Dellingr-SG-meeting-2017-11-29

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Dellingr steering group meeting

Time: 2017-11-29 12h00 CET

Place: https://zoom.us/j/3989300056

Invitations:

  • Kurt Gammelgaard Nielsen, DK
  • Hans Karlsson, SE
  • Vera Hansper, FI (outgoing SG member), accompanied by the Heta Koski (incoming SG member)
  • Ebba Þóra Hvannberg, IS
  • Ivar Koppel, ETAIS manager
  • Ilja Livenson, ETAIS
  • Tomasz Malkiewicz, NeIC, Project owner
  • John White, NeIC, Project manager

Agenda :


Dellingr SG 17-6-02 Update on partner and personnel commitments (for discussion) 10'

Dellingr SG 17-6-03 Executive summary of Phase 1 deliveries (for discussion) 10'

Dellingr SG 17-6-04 Additional requests towards Dellingr Phase 2 (NT1, Glenna2, Tryggve2, etc.) (for discussion) 10'

Dellingr SG 17-6-05 Updated project plan, version 2.8, draft (for discussion) 15'

Dellingr SG 17-6-06 Dellingr resource sharing pilot status and future (for discussion) 15'


Dellingr SG 17-6-07 Dellingr Phase 2 kick-off debrief (for discussion) 10'

Dellingr SG 17-6-08 Dellingr Phase 2 Collaboration Agreement status (for discussion) 10'

Dellingr SG 17-6-09 Assessment for NeIC Board (for notice) 5'

Dellingr SG 17-6-10 Estonian Scientific Computing Infrastructure (ETAIS) to join Dellingr Phase 2 as a partner (for decision) 10'

Dellingr SG 17-6-11 UNINETT Sigma2 AS proposal to be an observer in Dellingr Phase 2 (for decision) 10'

Dellingr SG 17-6-12 Next meetings 5'

Dellingr SG 17-6-13 AOB 5'

Minutes

Dellingr SG 17-6-01 Presence, approval of agenda 5

Presence

  • Kurt Gammelgaard Nielsen, DK (joint during item
  • Per-Olov Hammargren, SE, substituting for Hans Karlsson
  • Vera Hansper, FI (outgoing SG member), accompanied by the Heta Koski (incoming SG member)
  • Ebba Þóra Hvannberg, IS
  • Ivar Koppel, ETAIS manager, guest, items 17-6-01 - 17-6-09
  • Ilja Livenson, ETAIS, guest, items 17-6-01 - 17-6-09
  • Tomasz Malkiewicz, NeIC, Project owner
  • John White, NeIC, Project manager


Quick round table of the participants.



Decision:


The agenda for this meeting is approved.



Dellingr SG 17-6-02 Update on partner and personnel commitments (for discussion)

Discussion

Personnel commitments

DK, FI, IS, SE, (NO)
Weekly meetings


Project manager gave a brief status update. Highlights include:

  • The Current partners in the project have the named personnel and participate in the weekly meetings (Tuesday 12h00 CET).
  • The service agreements for phase 2 have been sent on November 1st 2017 by Kine Nordstokka (NeIC). No replies have been received yet (as of this meeting).
  • NO no longer a partner in the project, see agenda item 17-6-11. Bjorn continues until the end of the year and also but will continue in the weekly meetings as the NLPL representative.
  • Sweden has signed the service agreement as of 15/09/2017 and have three people who participate in the project. Per-Olov, Anders and Mathias.
  • John to check with Kine where/who the service agreements for FI and IS were sent to so we can forward to the SG members.


Partner commitments

Proposal: Partner Annual effort (FTEs) NeIC share Total effort (FTEs) for Phase 2

CSC 1 50% 2,5

CSUI 0,5 50% 1,25

DeIC 1 50% 2,5

ETAIS 1 50% 2,5

SNIC 1 50% 2,5

NeIC 0.5 100% 1,25

Total 5 12,50


NeIC partners (CSC, DeIC, SNIC) as well as ETAIS will provide resources as in-kind R&D activity. Of that committed R&D activity, NeIC funds 50%. The remaining partner funding will be aligned with national and EU funding. NeIC funds 0.5 FTE for a Project manager. The total number of FTEs for the duration of phase 2 of the project is estimated to reach 12,50 FTEs. The project also includes travel, workshop and some event costs; to be covered by NeIC. The budget proposal is as follows:


The SG finds the proposal well. Contribution includes resources, skilled people, expertise with Waldur tool.


ETAIS willing to contribute in developing sharing of resources, compute and storage, developing self-service tools, assistance with the high-level goals for resource sharing. Manpower: Ivar/Ilja to the end of the year, maybe more once the working methods of the project sorted out.


In general, for a 1 FTE effort, is it preferred to have more than one person contribute the effort.

Dellingr SG 17-6-03 Executive summary of Phase 1 deliveries (for discussion)

Executive summary: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gOdHuIMk-_TqblFf4HoarIzSK4yRkoMHvjMoT6T0Qp0/edit?usp=sharing


Discussion:


Corrected phrase regarding the initial pilot, replaced with use case. Otherwise the executive summary looks fine. Resource contributions within NLPL use case stay as agreed in the NLPL Collaboration Agreement.


Decision:


Approved.


Dellingr SG 17-6-04 Additional requests towards Dellingr Phase 2 (NT1, Glenna2, Tryggve2, etc.) (for discussion)

Discussion:


Two deliverables are foreseen:


1. NT1 support, draft proposal:

Delivery object 7: Support in enabling NT1 resource exchange

Content: Enabling resource exchange for NT1 collaboration. The models for balancing or compensating for uneven NT1 resource usage will be developed. These models can range from summing simple CPU-time and data storage size to sums weighted by the specifications of the shared computing and storage capacity. As an example, countries that have a possibility for expanding a tape library can do that in exchange for, e.g., providing less CPU. The work will include the study of necessary tools for enabling the exchange and analysis to ensure that the developed models are in-line with the strategies of the countries involved.

Recipient: NT1, the national providers and NeIC.

Delivery process: Delivery is a document describing the proposed metrics for resource exchanges within NT1, resource exchange mechanism and exchange rates. A group consisting of NT1 experts, NLCG committee chair, NT1 steering group, coordinated by the Dellingr Project Manager working on the metrics, Project Manager coordinating high-level discussions with the countries involved.

Delivery date: June 2018


Question as to what is actually be delivered? Is a 6 month timetable realistic? The Dellingr resource exchange model is still needed before it can be applied to NT1. What do they learn from the Dellingr project?


  • The NT1 project would like to be able to make equivalences between CPU cycles, storage types e.g. dCache, tape, disk. for example if a partner does not want to provide tape storage can it be equalized with some CPU cycles? Dellingr can work with the NT1 project to help with this challenge.


There can be a difference between value announced by a provider and the “actual” value. Is the resource being consumed?

Is this to enable people from outside the NT1 to share resources? (No). An external voice would be useful according to NT1. In order to compensate for uneven exchanges.


Comment that the WLCG commitments are known already. But these are made on collaboration-wide basis. The NT1 commits resources to ATLAS/ALICE based on a formula that accounts for authors etc. Within NT1 the commitments are “internal”.


2. Catalogue of HPC resources in the Nordics


Part of proposed by DK annual inventory of the e-infrastructure activity in the Nordic countries.


There have been preliminary discussions within Dellingr project. An inventory of e-infra in Nordics that looks at compute and storage. This is parallel to work in Dellingr (that looks at HPC). How much work will this be for Dellingr to take on? Will be quite extensive task if all institutes that have any computing are to be interviewed. Not sure if the effort to make this survey will be a big benefit. University of Iceland has a system to keep track of infrastructure. Is this available in other Universities? In Denmark there is an inventory for infrastructure in order to keep track of depreciation for economic reasons. But this not really indicate if the e-infra is available for others. What would be the scope of this survey? HPC only? Or cloud next?


In general it should be a small scope survey. Stick to HPC. See the page that Sweden provides for resources:


https://www.snic.se/apply-for-resources/available-resources

Dellingr SG 17-6-05 Updated project plan, version 2.8, draft (for discussion)

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fVDB_imL8b1s8TRcXj0eYspP-GKd2_Axttf8CBR-lh4/edit?usp=sharing


Discussion:


Move Phase 2 DO2 from April to September 2018.


Presentation by Kurt regarding work package related to DO7:

Benchmark all the known HPC resources in the Nordics using the standard developed by Bencheit/DeIC (which includes spending and numbers on HPC resources). Recipient: National providers. November 2017.



Comments

Sweden is buying storage in the short-term. Do the costs include electricity?


CSC: How are the installations counted? What is the meaning of 3 National and 5 local? There is also a Finnish Grid/Cloud.


In general DeIC has local access committees; NO is national; SE national. FI with CSCis also national. DK is different in couple of ways. Much more decentralized.


Iceland and Estonia still to be filled in on this table (both will fill in)


Proposal to keep the for DO7 and update annually? For NeIC there is the DO7. John continues from here.


What is the use of such a table? Need to have a “landscape” view on what DK has in terms of resources.


Decision:


This table will be useful for the DO7 of the project. Still to fill in the IS, EST information.


Dellingr SG 17-6-06 Dellingr resource sharing pilot status and future (for discussion)

Discussion:


List of the applications on the pilot: https://wiki.neic.no/int/Dellingr_Pilot_Applications


Experiences of hosting HPC sites in pilot: https://wiki.neic.no/int/Documenting_procedures/experience_for_the_pilot_applications


Proposal for pilot extension by 1 month and future: 1. Extend pilot to Jan 2018 in order to allow EST to participate; 2. End pilot application on Dec 2017; Wait for call later in project. 3. New pilot? What reasons? Anything new to be learned compared to current?


Proposal for 3Q2018 First steps towards:

  • The contributed shared resources will be made available to researchers in the Nordics through merit-based competitive mechanisms.


  • These mechanisms, for example a support structure for the open call and an “allocation committee”, will balance the capabilities, timelines and loads on the resources. This would be done through an open call from the National Providers.


How much of the committed resources are left in the pilot? If we have a new participant will there be space? The cut-off date is currently the end of the year. Estonia could participate even if the current deadline is unchanged. Would have to look at the availability of resources.


For an open call for October 2018. How much time do we need for the lessons learned?


For the continued sharing of resources (DO6), need to complete DO5 first (as talked in IS at the kick-off meeting)


(DK uncertain of our future, under reorganization and the review process, but would definitely like to stay in the project. The decision to be taken by DeiC Board in December. Currently considering the new setup. Reorganization process can take forever… Will carry on. After the current pilot. Interest to join in specific projects or tasks. In January… see where Jens may be reassigned, could be procurement process.)


Suggestions for what do do after the pilot phase ends:


  • (CSC) Another suggestion is to have interim test phase… don’t lose momentum. i.e. take some special projects to continue for a while.


  • (IS) Agree. Expressed at KO meeting. Have a continuum.


  • (EST) Try to minimize the bureaucracy on requests. Overhead is large for small projects. Should continue and try to improve the request/approval. Resource providers could automate their approval process.


Decision:


Take the inclusion of Estonia into the pilot to the project group. Are there enough resources left for them to “consume”?


Dellingr SG 17-6-07 Dellingr Phase 2 kick-off debrief (for discussion)

Kick-off minutes: https://wiki.neic.no/wiki/Dellingr_Phase_2_kick-off_meeting_minutes


Discussion: No comments.


Dellingr SG 17-6-08 Dellingr Phase 2 Collaboration Agreement status (for discussion)


Draft: - Includes ETAIS - Comments from SE: -- With regard to one another, each partner bear responsibility for implementation of the duties and obligations specified in the collaboration agreement and the project directive specified for the partner. -- In the event a partner does not perform the agreed R&D activity in a satisfactory manner, as well as on request by a partner who expects to be unable to perform in such a way in the future, the steering group may decide to transfer responsibility for the work in whole or in part to one of the other partners, based on specified terms and conditions, given consent of the partner to whom the responsibility is transferred.


Discussion:


If Estonia is accepted to the project, the EST responsibilities are to be defined by the Project manager. Collaboration agreement to be finalised and sent to all for signing.


Dellingr SG 17-6-09 Assessment for NeIC Board (for notice)

Reporting by NeIC management to NeIC Board includes a summary report from each main project concerning Result, Cost/resource, and Time goals. In addition, a one-liner summarising the status is expected from each project.


Traffic lights’ assessment: all green: On track. Phase 1 delivery objects approved, pilot underway, Phase 2 launched.


Dellingr SG 17-6-10 Estonian Scientific Computing Infrastructure (ETAIS) to join Dellingr Phase 2 as a partner (for decision)

Estonian Scientific Computing Infrastructure (ETAIS


More info: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1jSsch1XsZEJO3Wx6b1dInCIp8Gvd9hWrtPRyO80ksc4/edit?usp=sharing ) expressed interest in joining Dellingr. ETAIS representatives met with NeIC Board in June 2017 and with the NeIC XT on 22.11. ETAIS views its contribution to Dellingr as follows:


- Providing ETAIS resources as service provider - Consuming HPC services from NeIC partners - Deploying a Waldur-based marketplace for provisioning and managing these services as “Dellingr self-service”.

ETAIS to join the project and replace Sigma2, which withdrew from Dellingr Phase 2. ETAIS is to participate in the same volume as Sigma2, i.e., 1 FTE.


The Dellingr Steering Group is to discuss and decide on 29.11. on Estonia joining the project (replacing NO).


Discussion:


Good idea, nothing against.


Decision: Unanimously approved.



Dellingr SG 17-6-11 UNINETT Sigma2 AS proposal to be an observer in Dellingr Phase 2 (for decision)

Message from Sigma2 received on 9.11. stating that Sigma2 is planning to withdraw from the Dellingr Phase 2 and participate as an observer. On 20.11. formal withdrawal, effective with the launch of Phase 2, i.e., 15.09.2017.


The motivation/rationale for being the observer, as well as, if applicable, a plan/roadmap for Sigma2 rejoining the Dellingr requested from Sigma2: “The motivation and rationale is to see if the project is moving towards what we consider its original purpose, and this is also the essential factor in any plan or roadmap to rejoin.”



Discussion:


Unless the factors keeping Sigma2 out of the project disappear, there is no reason to consider rejoining. Different views on Sigma2 participation as an observer, the majority supports it.


Decision:


Sigma2 is welcome to participate as observer to the SG.


Dellingr SG 17-6-12 Next meetings

Proposal:


1 face-to-face meeting in Q12018, two online meeting later on.


Discussion:


8th March suits all.


DK or FI or EST among possible locations.


Decision:


March 8th 2018. Location TBC.


Dellingr SG 17-6-13 AOB

None.


SG thanks Vera for good collaboration and wishes all the best in the future endeavours.

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